olivença is from portugal or spain?

What I was trying to know is of whether the people from Olivença view themselves as either Spanish or Portuguese?

yeah...that would be my question...*nod*

olivença is portugues ther is no doubt about it

olivença is from Portugal

And who gives a f*ck?
Seems you ignore what's going on in your own country :/

Iberia: unite Spain and Portugal
28% of Portuguese and 45% of Spaniards want to unify Spain and Portugal

Portugal and Spain will become one, says Nobel author

we do care about it,Olivença is portugues land.
portugues do not want unit wit spain never.
some spanish could want that,bath it will never happen.
Quebeque will be independet from canada yes,
free Quebeque!

28% of the Portuguese polled wouldn't mind already, and I bet those people of Olivença prefer to live as Spaniards.

you said 28% of portugues want to be unit wit spain bat ther was never a referendum cauze never portugues will want that.
Olivença is portugues land bath spain refusse to give up on our land and even forbiten olivença people to speak portugues.
Quebeque is a free stat that deserve independece from canada,
free quebeque! 48% percent of people in quebeque want independence bath canada refuse to give up.
so for you if a cauntry like spain ( or other) invade another wit no reason and then deport the portugues and put spanish in lik that even if ther is a referedum it will be spanish to vote it will be not just.is like USA taking a part of canada and puth american in canada to vote for unit one region of canada to USA it will be not right.
well is what it happen.
bath portugues didn´t puth bomb´s or fight with armes,
portugues allway´s take this issu pacifiquly and talk in peace we will not enter in war cauze of that,
is about justice and honor.
like many other place in the world with similair problemes.

You are funny smarty, I just quoted the results of a poll carried out by a PORTUGUESE newspaper.
Maybe instead of copy pasting long dull stuff, you could post which is the situation TODAY in Olivença.

the situacion in Olivença is:
spanish gouvermont send spanish people to live ther.
spanish gouvermont forbiten peolpe in Olivença to learn portugues.
spanish refusse to discut this issu.
even if ther is a referedum in Olivença spanish gouvermont allready send spanish people to live in olivença so even if ther is a referedum half people in Olivença are coming from spain so it will be not juste.
Olivença belong rightly to portugues.
that´s why spain have fraid to talk about it.
Olivença is not like gibraltar or ceuta or basque cauntry,
cauze in the internacional law it belong to portugal so ther is no need to have a referedum.
if mexico send 10milion mexican people to arizona and then ask referedum to arizona to be mexican or american the referedum will be win by mexican.
so Olivença is portugues and spanish deport the portugues from ther wen napoleon enter in war wit portugal cauz portugal was helping the british fight against napoleon.

JAJAJA tio de ke vaas?
--spanish gouvermont send spanish people to live ther.
The Spanish government don't "send" people. Spaniards and Portuguese are free to live there if they want to. Ever heard about the Schengen Treaty?
--spanish gouvermont forbiten peolpe in Olivença to learn portugues.
JAJAJA, in fact learning Portuguese was optional at Olivenza's schools, and I believe the city council requested a permission to make Portuguese obligatory some time ago.
--spanish refusse to discut this issu.
I'm Spanish and I can only say that you don't have a clue what you are talking about.
--Olivença belong rightly to portugues.
Yeah, depending who you ask, and considering your knowledge of European history I highly doubt you are an authority.

i can see that you are not well inform,
bath is ok,
cauze you got now the opurtunity to learn.
Olivença is at the internacional low belong to portugal,
spanish govermont will do like it had did till today that is to try to not discusse this issu in bruxelles parlamente cauz it knows that portugal is right and will win if it goes to bruxelles or ONU.
Olivença is not like basque cauntry or ceuta or gibraltar.
i invite you to learn more about this issu.
is normal if you dont know,bath now you know..
even if you are spanish you cant say truly that Olivença is a true spanish land cauz is not.
Olivença belong to portugal since XII century.
Gibraltar is british and spain dont like that,well i´m gladd that gibraltar is british:)cauze spain take ceuta from portugal in 1640 and Olivença in 1801,keep ceuta cauze marroco will win ceuta from spain.
Olivença is portugues,bat portugues dont put bombs to discusse this issu cauze portugal is not a terrorist cauntry and the politician in portugal dont do enought to take this issu to bruxelles.
bath this matter will be solve!
Olivença is Portugues nobody can say the oposite in the eyes of internacional law.

Man, I might be "not well informed", but at least I'm not talking s**t and telling lies about the Spanish government "moving people" or prohibiting the use of the Portuguese language in Olivenza.
As far I can see the only thing you are good at, it's copy pasting stuff you don't even understand.

i know that you are not "well informed" your comment show that. i puth more information in english to people can andertein and read.
you still dont have read the articl about Olivença i can see that.i anderstein that you spanish and you will defend that you dont want to loose a land that was never spanish.
spain will face the facts soon or later.
gibraltar will continue british in the south of spain:)
yes spanish deport portugues from Olivença and forbiten portugues to be learn in Olivença.
since the europeean union that thing´s change bath spain still dont want to leave this small land that belong to portugal.
spain can keep ceuta that was portugues cauze we dont want ceuta enymore,bat Olivença is portugues and even you can denied that.i invite you to read more.
like that wen the issu of Olivença will go to bruxelles or ONU you allready know the true.

:) You sound like a kid Joao, talking bu**s**t without offering any proof whatsoever. Personally as Spaniard I don't give a fu** about Gibraltar or Olivenza, you can keep them as long Portugal and UK belong to the EU, because at the end it won't matter.
The funny thing is that you keep whining about losing Olivenza in the War of the Oranges back in 1801 where your asses were kicked, so what? Maybe I should be the one who invites you to learn your history better.
Today Olivenza is free to speak portuguese and all EU citizens are welcome there. Any problem with that?
My advice to you: If you want to live in the past, try at least to know the facts right, not what you copy from a silly nationalist site in internet.

so if you say that why spanish gouvermant want gibraltar..
if we are in UE so ther is no need to wanting gibraltar..
you allready tell that you dont know this issu,
i see that you have read a litl now,buth you dont have read all,france and spanish attake portugal in 1801 becauze portugal is a frend of england.
so in 1807 spain sign a in the congresse of wiena the restituacion of Olivença taking by the french army and spanish army to portugal.
bath spain lies and didn´t give back Olivença.
spain have a long history of lies,i could tell you severel exemples bath right now the issu is Olivença.
so the day will arrive that basque cauntry,galizia and catalunha will be independet to.so if you think that gibraltar will be back to spain you can dream on it,Olivença will be back to portugal first cauze the internacional law is in the side of portugal,bat spain dont fallow internacional law.. for you information is not a nacionalist site cauze nacionalist and politician in portugal still dont take the issu of Olivença to bruxelles cauze ther is otheres things "more important".spain still dont have honor to give to portugal wat is from portugal.so spain can forget gibraltar:)

Again, you're the one who should be better informed. The last time Spain officially protested about the Gibraltar issue, I believe it was back in 2006, was in regard of their sovereignty plans, which is quite a different case.
--so in 1807 spain sign a in the congresse of wiena
JAJAJA, sure, in 1807. Another proof you don't have a clue of what you talk about. Spain didn't signed the Treaty of Vienna until 1817, and not because of their agreement to the Olivenza issue.
By the way, clause 105 of the Treaty of Vienna is not mandatory on demanding Spain to return Olivenza to Portugal.
So you can keep whining Joao. Like i said, if you ask me, Portugal can keep their Olivenza and the UK, Gibraltar.
Spain growth forecast this year is of 3,0% vs. Portugals's 1.8% in the Eurozone. Maybe some people should put more efforts reducing their unemployment rates than talking s*i* and blaming others for their situation.

spain try to invade portugal severel times bat portugues army kik the hase of spanish in severel battels,last one was in aljubarota,spanish army was 3time more than portugues and we win and maintein our independece,only time portugal was unit wit spain was wen the king of portugal married the queen of spain,bat king of portugal was dede soon after,this union last 60years,it was the only time that portugal and spain work togheter.france declar war on portugal and spain take this chance to also declar war wit the hope to have portugues land.
actually in spain people win more money than in portugal,bath if you ask portugues if they want to win money and loos the independence i think you know wat will be the answer,only the comunist will want that or people that dont love portugal or dont care cauz it will never happen,spain will break apart wit basque cauntry,catalunha,asturias,galiza,portugal is unit,ther is no region in portugal that want independece.
Galizia ask to portugues to enter in palops(cauntry that spoke portugues organizacion)and portugal refuse cauze galego is portugues bath is difrent.
if spain want gibraltar it will have to give Olivença.
ceuta was portugues and was devolve to portugues in 1640 bat is ok dont matter cauz marroco iss insisting to have back,will ceuta and mellila return to marroco..
well Olivença will be issu soon or later in bruxelles cauze spain sign the traity and didn´t do wat it was supose to do.
remember peru wit ataualpa that spain ask for gold to send free the prisionier king of inca and wen the ransom was pay spanish didn´t send free ataualpa they kild him.
so wer is the honor of spain,
saing something and do other..

JAJAJA You can't be serious, "remember atagualpa"?. Only a very ignorant person would talk s**t about a neighbor when both have commited the same mistakes in history.
Why don't you remember about your Inquisition in Portugal?, or about kicking also the Jews out; Why don't you remember your benefits with slave trade?; Why don't you remember your genocides in West Africa, or Brazil in your colonialism period?. I bet you can explain to me what kind of honor there are is such things.

Seems that Portugal has also some dead bodies in the closet :)

and sinc then that this issu isnt solve:S

Maybe Portugal and Spain should start with the older issues, like apologizing for the massacres in the colonialist days. What about that?

that allready happen Betty,bath this issu continue unsolve:s
cauz spanish gouvermont dont want to speak about that also.

When did Portugal apologized?

it did for other things not massacres Betty
does canadian gouvernmant ask apologize wen they exterminet the indian population wit venon and mass murder(?)

When did the "Canadian government" exterminated any Indian population?
Grab a history book Joao, you look very ignorant.

Betty by the way u say that seem that u dont know nothing about canadian historie.weher are the native people of north america,why they all dissapear.. didnt u never wonder why..
look at the south america,why u see so meny indian native in south america and u see only a few in north america,dont try to hide it.

You're the only who behaves here like a smartass Joao. At the colonial time, when Portugal and Spain were plundering and murdering around the world, Canada didn't existed yet, not until 1867. So much about your history knowledge.

so by your words the mass murder of indian is not canadian responsability cauz at the time it was not independent,ho yeah nice argumant u got their.
if portugues and spanish did the same as north americans at this time their was no indian native in south america like in north america weher ther is only a few community of native indians that survive severel genocides made by nort americans.

The funny thing is that you keep talking about "north americans" when at that time only the english and french colonized that area.
The Portuguese and the Spaniards were so arrogant and foolish to divide the world in a treaty with the blessings of the Vatican, so that they could murder, plunder a convert everybody to Catholicism.

dont blame french and english for that,blaming otheres is that the way.. i agree with u wen u referingto spanish,spanish did meny attrocity,bath nothing compare with nort america genocide.. portugues didnt made eny thing close to that.
ask to eny body that live in a cauntry that have portugues and british colonized to tell u the diference betwin portugues colonized and british or neederlish or french colonized...
u will be admire by the answer.. look at macau and hong kong and see how portugues manage a colonie in china and the way british manage hong kong,and u will anderstein the difference,if u dont anderstein thedifference ask indonesian people the diference betwin neederlish colonize and portugues colonized they also will tell u the diference.. portugues buy slaves yes that´s true african tribes sell them,portugal weher the first cauntry to abolish slavery.ifcanada weher colonized by portugal now they will be more indian native living their,your cauntry is responsable for 100 millions death,worst than stalin and pol pot and mao tzé tsung togheter..

I see you like inventing and talking nonsenses without any support whatsoever, like in the case of Olivenca.

Just exactly WHAT international law says this region belongs to either side?
And 48% of Quebecers does NOT make up a majority. Another splinter group for you. You want to see the world broken up into so many small pieces. Great Idea! LOL

ron quebeque is another issu,we can talk about that,
quebeque is french land take by the british army at the time,
french speakers weher terrorise by british and with canada lots of english speakers colones weher send to quebeque.
i dont want to see the world broken in small piece,
i want to see community´s watching for their value.
portugues have more to worry,and the peacful people dont want to incomodat.even so this issu cant go away cauz its legaly land of portugal,spain have to give back this land as they said they would in wiena.

Oh Hell NO. We've talked about Quebec before, and you made about as much sense there as you do here.
You also do know, don't you, that the smart French moved to Louisiana when Britain too Canada from France?
You do realize many things have changed since the Treaty of Vienna. Or, on second thought, Do You?

aw dammit...they got Ron spun up *cackle*

How you doing, Thomas? No I'm not spun up. It makes me laugh when all this guy does is look for some small insignificant piece of land that someone has and someone else claims. It's just not fair, you know what I mean? I'm going to tell my mom, I'm sure she can do something about this.
Now he's back on Quebec. Can'y you just see Canada giving Quebec away? Next, California will leave the U.S. Who knows Mongolia may leave Asia. It IS that easy you know.

nodnod...yeah...sometimes splitting into smaller is detrimental rather than beneficial...Quebec is a fine example of that.
Guatemala and Belize have similar issues...Belize used to be part of Guatemala until the people living there realized that Belize was a former British "colony" and the rest of Guatemala was former Spanish territory, so they sued for self determination. With the backing of England, they became their own deal. People in Guatemala were furious over it, of course, but what could be done?
Now, Belize has an economy the relies heavily on tourism, and has had several bad years thanks to hurricanes, etc...
Are they better off? In some things, yes, but on the whole, no...foodstuffs are more expensive...most things have to be imported thus raising the costs, etc...
None of it makes any sense...in a world of globalism, countries should be trying to find ways to join and unite...eliminating borders, etc...and it seems the latest fashion is to just tear it all apart and create new ones...sad really.

Agreed, we should all try to join together for the betterment of the world. Oooops, one exception: Olivenca. Isn't 200 years of foreign occupation enough? When will it all stop.
I'm really serious, at least this piqued my interest enought to check out Olivenca on the net. There might really be such a place.

yeah...kind of like California, Nevada, New Mexico, Texas and Arizona used to be part of Mexico...and have had US occupation since the late 1850´s...right.
If a country loses/cedes land in a war or as part of a pact of surrender...the land is gone...and the victor isn't a "foreign" occupation...it is a taking of possession (now...all of this is contingent on the "reasons" for the war obviously, but that is a whole other issue). If Spain took the territory by force, and/or the Portuguese ceded it by treaty (which I believe happened...my knowledge of history is a bit weak in that area) then case closed...

san lucas spain and france have loos the war against the allies great britain,portugal,poland,germany etc
after the allies win the war, spain sign a treaty in wiena to give back the occupide land in Olivença.

If this is the case, with such powerful allies, why hasn't it happened in 200 years?
That was then, this is now.

it have happen,see the ling www.olivenca.org
bat the portgues dont act as terrorist to solve things and only to peace discussion,and spain dont want to discusse that,so it have to go to europeen council

I read the article, 28% is a lot! :)
If Portugal and Spain could ever politically/economically unite they could become the most important EU member ...
Many people would be really pissed about that.

no portugal and spain will not be unit,
we are unite by the UE and is ok like that.
well spain can unit wit france or andorra bat next time spain is unit wit france i hope that is not for attak portugal once again:)
portugal and spain are allready important in the UE and in the world cauze of cultur and language.
the nacionalist party in portugal dont talk about Olivença cauze they talk only about deporting emigrant out of portugal and europe they dont talk about Olivença cauze is been more than 185years that spain dont have the honor to keep the word right in wiena and give back Olivença that belong to Portugal.
wen napoleon and spain was defeit by the english and portugues,portugal didn´t ask to british to take spanish territory cauze portugal dont want wat is not portugues.
olivença is portugues and will allway´s be.
portugal give to much to spain,canarias,marroco,spanish guinée,philipines,ceuta,etc
almost all cauntry in europe wer jelous of portugal and try and many time wit sucesse to still wat belong to portugal.
bat the issu of Olivença have the internacional law beside portugal so it will be solve in bruxelles or in the ONU,
does portugal need to call USA to send trops to Olivença..

:) I wasn't talking to you, and just let me tell you that I really doubt that you have any insight about international politics whatsoever.
You really must be pissed that 28% of the portuguese wouldn't mind to unite with spain :)

well 45% of spanish want to be wit portugues,
portugal have emigrants living in the cauntry
so emigrantes dont love portugal suche portugues does.
you must know that cauze spain have a lot emigrantes is start to be dificult to find spanish people in spain.
so if you ask to poor people,comunist,if they want to win 1000euros each month and be spanish some will say yes bath dont worry cauz it will never happen:)
Olivença is a issu that will go to bruxelles and then it will be solve.cauze like you have learne today;the internacional law is in the side of portugal,if it wasn´t like that portugal will never ask for something that dont belong to us.spain can keep ceuta that was also still to portugues cauze marroco will take care of that:)
personally i prefer to see ceuta in the spanish hand than in marroco hands,i was in ceuta last year and i see the flag wit the portugues symbol above the cuty of ceuta cauze the flag of ceuta have the simbole of portugal.
spanish are furious wit gibraltar bat portugues seem to be sleeping about Olivença cauze people acomodate to the situacion,bat not all the people cauz this issu will go to bruxelles.

Why does the USA need to send troops? Can't Portugal solve problems by itself?

ron i am not asking eny one to send troops,
portugues didnt start wit terrorism about this and other issu.
their is documents sign by all europeans incluid spain and portugal that say Olivença is portugues land,
time goes by and spain didnt leave Olivença.
portugues gouvernmant have stoped to talk about that only organizacion take this issu that spain dont want to talk about,
this must go to europeen commision,it will be a start to solve this once for all.

@knightprincipe, you said "their is documents sign by all europeans incluid spain and portugal that say Olivença is portugues land"
that's your personal interpretation

"does portugal need to call USA to send trops to Olivença.."

Sure looks to me like you want the US to send troops.
All Europeans signed a document. Spain doesn't leave Olivenca because it's clear to me they own it for sure by now, how many hundreds of years now?
A while ago you said Portugal doesn't talk about it, Spain doesn't talk about it, now you say Portuguese government ahs stopped talking about it. Doesn't seem like a very big issue to anyone but you. Like I said, form an army and go take it over. Your own little kingdom.

Never mind the parrot Fran :)
This other guy Joao keeps repeating the same stuff and can't argue logically any of the peoples' comments in the thread. Just a waste of time.

look i just tell the facts,i cant invent new fact their are wat they are.thank´s enyway

Because it's the same old story with him, and he never really has any basis for any of it. Just wants everyone to have their own little country.

@roninxian, what really annoys me it's the many good arguments that several people have posted here. i really hate when people is just capable of copy&pasting stuff over and over again with reasoning a bit ...

Hey, my friend, not everyone was born with a thinking mind. Some resort only to cutting and pasting. It makes them look smart. This boy did a good job of pasting a treatise that I doubt anyone, including himself, read.

this link for u Betty,sinc u dont know history of north america..

http://www.iearn.org/hgp/aeti/aeti-1997/native-americans.html

LOL, besides being that link a High School paper, it's inaccurate and NOT surprisingly, it has nothing to do with your silly claims that the "Canadian government" is responsible for any native american genocide.

On the other hand it's clear and documented, for example, that ... The king of Portugal, for example, was instructed to "capture, vanquish, and subdue" infidel peoples, "to put them into perpetual slavery," and to take away "all their possessions and property." In 1493, shortly after the first voyage of Cristobal Colon to the Americas, Pope Alexander VI issued the Inter Cetera bull of May 4th, in which he called for "barbarous nations" to be "subjugated" or overthrown so as to "propagate" the "Christian Empire."

wen spanish arrive in wat is now mexico they find a cultur that live by severel humain sacrifice,cuting heads off and other things like that,even after that spanish didnt made genocide on them,in mexico u find severel indian tribes,i dont want to defend spanish cauz they did severel dirty jobs more lot more than portugues,bat nothing compare wit the genocide in north america,weher are the indian tribes from north america,all death:( sham

You can keep inventing and talking nonsenses all you want Joao, like in the case of Olivenca.

meh...28% in favor means 72% either oppose or have no vested opinion. Same in Spain...45% in favor means 55% oppose...etc...

HOWEVER, unifying the Iberian countries would create an economic Titan in the EU...not to mention they would most likely pass France in population/military. Some clout that would be, eh?

From your map, it appears this is a little finger of land that is encroaching into Spain.

and who cares??? i think only uuuuu!!!!!

invite u to see this link,u not well inform,
www.olivenca.org

good job thanx about Info ^_^

thanks i made it for people been informed the best possible:)

well i would say its from portugal but it now a bit of a loner and is not from anywhere anymore hahaha though im probably wrong. hey like ive said many times before im not very geographical. not at all in fact hahaha